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Ah, Athanasios, Athanasios, Athanasios ... Imprimer
Auteur : PGM
Sujet : Ah, Athanasios, Athanasios, Athanasios ...
Date : 2003-10-25 20:43:36

Vous avez un don pour tout mélanger, parfois. Les réponses, dans l'ordre :

1- Oui.

2- Très rapidement. Si vous aviez seulement lu l'article de Sungenis dont je vous donnais le lien à mon post précédent vous auriez lu ceci :

" ...Hole #7: Mr. Mahowald then tries to tie all the loose ends together by taking a second look at the state of Russia, seeking to convince us that the Traditionalist Movement’s expectations of the conversion of Russia have all been askew. Poor Traditionalists. They were all expecting a real conversion of souls to the Catholic faith, like the many other times that Our Lady has promised and fulfilled such prophecies of conversion. As my essay points out:


On May 13, 1931, Our Lady gave evidence of what to expect from a faithfully performed consecration. On that date, in the presence of 300,000 Catholics at Fatima, the bishops of Portugal consecrated their nation to the Immaculate Heart of Mary. Their motive was to protect Portugal from the threat of communism that was sweeping Europe. The Red Army had already enveloped Spain, their closest neighbor. Miraculously, in a few short years after the consecration, the Portugese people experienced an astounding change. In less than ten years, the number of religious vocations quadrupled. Catholic radio, a Catholic press, Catholic pilgrimages and spiritual retreats dotted the landscape as never before. The country was totally transformed, to say the least. Antonia Salazar took the reigns of government in 1933 and inaugurated a Catholic social movement unprecedented in recent history, wherein government and Catholic ideals were integrated at the highest levels. The nuclear family was restored to its inherent value. Divorce was outlawed. By 1960, over 90% of all Portugal’s marriages were canonical. Salazar’s efforts were so extraordinary that he received personal congratulations from Pius XII for producing a model country for the world to follow. And that’s not all. While countries around them were being swallowed up by Nazism and Communism, Portugal was miraculously spared the effects both of the Spanish Civil War and any repercussions of World War II. On February 6, 1939, Sister Lucia wrote to her bishop in Portugal, Monsignor da Silva, stating: “...in this horrible war [World War II], Portugal would be spared because of the national consecration to the Immaculate Heart of Mary made by the bishops” (The Whole Truth About Fatima, p. 428). At about the same time, Sister Lucia wrote to Pius XII and told him that, had the other nations done likewise, they would have enjoyed the same blessings as Portugal.
Similarly, after the apparition of Our Lady at Guadalupe to Juan Diego, in less than ten years, nine million Aztecs turned from paganism to Christianity. So why wouldn’t we expect a similar occurrence for an even greater prophecy of conversion from the Fatima revelations? But now we are told by Mr. Mahowald that such an expectation is “the wrong view.” He first tries to make headway by claiming that “there was no time limit given by Our Lady as to when Russia will be converted, only that she will.” Like we haven’t heard this before? The only thing Mr. Mahowald really tells us by this conjecture is that he admits Russia hasn’t been converted!

Try as he may, Mr. Mahowald then attempts to convince us with a quote from Vladimir Feodorov, which purports to document all the so-called “freedoms” Russians are now enjoying to practice their “religion.” Here he engages in selective news editing. He conveniently forgets such recent news items as the Russian government, prompted by the Russian Orthodox Church, just a couple of years ago told the pope to “stay out of Russia,” and refused to renew the licenses of Catholic parishes all over Russia? In Russia today, almost 20 years after the 1984 consecration, there are hardly any more Catholics than there were in 1917 when Our Lady first appeared at Fatima. There are many similar stories I could reveal. Please see my essay for details.

Oh, but there is one other possibility to explain Mr. Mahowald’s present viewpoint. Perhaps in line with the ecumenists at the Vatican, Mr. Mahowald is now convinced that the Russian Orthodox Church is the answer to the “conversion of Russia,” for that is what is implied in his quote from Feodorov, as he writes:


The majority of Russians remain loyal to the traditional Russian Orthodox Church and cling to a notion of the place of the church in the state which goes back to the times before the 1917 revolution.
Of the two paragraphs Mr. Mahowald quotes from Feodorov, you won’t find one reference to “Catholicism” in Russia. That’s because Mr. Mahowald knows there is virtually none there. If there was, he would have been shouting it from the housetops as a fulfillment of the “consecration to the Immaculate Heart of Mary.” Instead, Mr. Mahowald has suddenly turned into an ecumenist, taking the party line from the Vatican that one religion is just as good as another, just as long as we all strive toward God and world peace. Perhaps there is more to Mr. Mahowald’s “questioning” of Traditionalism than just in-fighting over Fatima. He appears to have already turned the corner, looking for evidence of the consecration in all the wrong places."

3a- Le problème demeure : pourquoi affirmait-elle que la consécration de la "Russie" n'avait toujours pas été faite de 1984 à 1989, puis pourquoi change-t-elle de "discours" cette même année 1989 ? Remarquez, comme Sungenis l'indique si bien, qu'elle re4connait qu'une consécration a été faite, mais pas celle de la Russie. Lisez l'article de Sungenis, vous dis-je.

3b- Et de grâce ! Athanasios, mon gars, si vous avez l'impression farfelue que le Wanderer est une publication traditionaliste, je vous plains. C'est même tout le contraire. C'est un cas de manuel de cette étrange dérive qu'il faut bien appeler par son nom : du néo-catholicisme. Vous êtes un peu comme ces gauchistes qui choisisent leurs interlocuteurs parmis les libéraux en proclamant bien haut que ces derniers sont "la droite", "les conservateurs". Ça leur permet de gagner le débat avec un bras dans le dos, mais les mots ne veulent plus rien dire, alors. À ce jeux, le cardinal Kasper est un catholique réactionnaire et un parangon d'orthodoxie, sauf qu'hélas les mots ne veulent plus rien dire.

4- Et s'Il revenait et discréditait la vôtre, diriez-vous que c'est un "schismatique" ?

Si vous avez lu l'Écriture sainte sur la Parousie de NSJC, je crois que la nature même de l'événement, les signes qui y seront associés ne devrait laisser personne dans le doute.

In Christo,

PGM



La discussion

 La Russie a-t-elle..., de Athanasios D. [2003-10-24 13:31:38]
      sujet intéressant, de Michel2T [2003-10-24 14:49:03]
          C'était, de Louis [2003-10-24 14:53:34]
              Vous êtes ..., de Fennec [2003-10-24 15:34:05]
                  Pour ma part..., de Athanasios D. [2003-10-24 15:37:20]
                      ????? -pdt-, de Eymerich [2003-10-24 15:40:15]
                           , de Athanasios D. [2003-10-24 15:51:08]
                      Vous..., de Fennec [2003-10-24 15:45:29]
                      Si ne connaissais, de Louis [2003-10-24 15:51:12]
                          Sont pas pressés..., de Athanasios D. [2003-10-24 16:02:32]
                              Oui, de Eymerich [2003-10-24 16:09:45]
                  Jeune ?, de Louis [2003-10-24 15:49:40]
                      Ce 3ème secret a été, de Fennec [2003-10-24 15:59:58]
                          Malheureusement, de Louis [2003-10-24 16:15:00]
                              Bravo -pdt-, de olo [2003-10-24 16:17:10]
                              le secret substitué, de EA [2003-10-24 16:46:16]
                                  Lucie a authentifié le secret publié -pdt-, de Réginald [2003-10-24 16:58:19]
                                      ON a dit qu'elle a authentifié, de EA [2003-10-26 13:16:17]
                                          On ??????, de Réginald [2003-10-26 13:47:05]
                                              Et le Portugal ?, de EA [2003-10-26 14:58:19]
                                                  sur le Portugal, de Réginald [2003-10-26 15:14:11]
                                                      Où est alors le 4ème mémoire, de EA [2003-10-26 19:10:32]
                                                          Lisez le texte de la CDF -pdt-, de Réginald [2003-10-26 19:18:55]
                                                              Précisément, je l'ai lu, de EA [2003-10-26 19:46:12]
                                                                  Etc... : Non oportet publicare -pdt-, de Réginald [2003-10-26 19:53:20]
                                                                      Ah oui ? Et pourquoi non opportet ?, de PGM [2003-10-27 00:19:14]
                                                                      Merci !, de EA [2003-10-27 12:26:21]
                                                                          Et moi, de Réginald [2003-10-27 12:58:58]
                                                                              Tout est possible !, de EA [2003-10-27 16:08:19]
                              Si ça peut vous enlever un poids sur ..., de PGM [2003-10-24 22:23:47]
                  Sur le Père Gruner, de Karolus [2003-10-24 18:45:18]
                      Je regrette, mais ..., de PGM [2003-10-24 21:30:36]
                          Une question:, de Athanasios D. [2003-10-25 18:45:47]
                              Ah, Athanasios, Athanasios, Athanasios ..., de PGM [2003-10-25 20:43:36]